In Episode 127 of the Renaissance English History Podcast, I get to fangirl all over Michael Radi, whose musical The King’s Legacy, is premiering this month in New York. If you’re anywhere close, you should check it out. Or, you can see him at Tudorcon in October.
Learn more about the musical (and Michael) here: https://www.thekingslegacymusical.com/michael-radi
Check out the music on his YouTube Channel
https://www.youtube.com/user/OriginalMicMusic/videos
You can also support the show by making a tax-deductible contribution:
Checks can be made out to:
“Bristol Valley Theater” with “The King’s Legacy – Heather Teysko” on the Memo line.
Checks can be mailed to:
Bristol Valley Theater, PO Box 218, Naples, NY 14512
OR donations are able to be made online via card or through paypal! I’ve included the link below. When donating online there is an optional line for a memo, so be sure to write that the donation is specifically for “The King’s Legacy – Heather Teysko” to make certain it goes to the right place!
http://bvtnaples.org/individual-donations/
[advertisement insert here: if you like this show, and you want to support me and my work, the best thing you can do (and it’s free!) is to leave a rating or review on iTunes. It really helps others discover the podcast. Second best is to buy Tudor-themed gifts for all your loved ones at my shop, at TudorFair.com, like leggings with the Anne Boleyn portrait pattern on them, or boots with Elizabeth I portraits. Finally, you can also become a patron of this show for as little as $1/episode at Patreon.com/englandcast … And thank you!]
Episode transcript:
Hello, and welcome to the Renaissance English History Podcast, a part of the Agora Podcast Network. My name is Heather Teysko. I’m your host, and I’m a storyteller who makes history accessible because I believe it’s a pathway to understanding who we are, our place in the universe, and being much more deeply connected with our own humanity.
So this is Episode 127. And this is an interview with Michael Radi. I want to tell you who Michael Radi is. He is a composer, a lyricist, a vocal director, a general all-around musical impresario genius. And he first came to my attention back in January, he messaged me about a new musical that he was doing called The King’s Legacy. And it’s about Elizabeth I and I have to tell you, I was a theater nerd growing up and I would belt out Andrew Lloyd Webber musicals all the time. I had all the Andrew Lloyd Webber Greatest Hits, all that kind of stuff. That was just kind of my schtick in high school and college. So there is very little that I love in the world more than Tudor history. And there’s also very little that I love in the world more than musical. So combining the two is just perfect, and makes me really, really excited. So I immediately wrote back to him and said, How can I help you publicize this? And also, can you come to Tudorcon? And so he’s going to be at Tudorcon. So he’s going to be there on the Saturday – well, he’s going to be there the whole event, I think, but he’s performing on the Saturday evening. He’s bringing some of the singers down and we’re going to have live music from The King’s Legacy. So we’re going to have a little musical evening out on Saturday night and that’s part of Tudorcon.
So over the next couple of episodes, I’m going to intersperse some interviews with Tudorcon speakers for a couple of reasons. First, for those of you who are coming to Tudorcon, I want to give you a taste of the speakers that you’re going to see, and a little background, and just kind of get you generally hyped up and excited for those of you who aren’t yet signed up to come to Tudorcon. Well, I want you to come to Tudorcon, so I want you to see what you’re going to be missing if you don’t come, right? So there are a couple of different ways you can participate.
You can come live in person, it is October 18 to 20th in Lancaster, Pennsylvania at a private facility, a winery in a restored 1790’s barn. It’s beautiful next to the Pennsylvania Renaissance Faire, and it’s three days. It starts Friday afternoon, Friday evening with a welcoming party, there’s going to be a costume party, you don’t have to come in costume. I’m not going to be in costume, but a lot of people are, and there’s gonna be period music and entertainment period games. It’s going to be super fun! Then on Saturday, we start with the talks, we start first thing in the morning with talks. We break for a catered lunch that’s included, and there’ll be book signings, there’ll be demonstrations of kind of period fiber arts, all that kind of stuff. And that is Saturday. Saturday, we go until about five o’clock in the afternoon. And then we’ll go into town, into downtown Lancaster to see The King’s Legacy, the music from the King’s legacy. And then we’ll have dinner together on our own or as a group. How ever we want to do that. Then Sunday, we come back for talks at 10 o’clock in the morning. We have talks all morning, and then we break for a medieval feast, and that is in the afternoon. That’ll be kind of a late lunch kind of 1:30/2 o’clock. And then our feast, we’ll have private entertainment from the Renaissance Fair, it’s going to be super fun. And then we get to go to the Renaissance Faire as well, and the Renaissance Faire’s open until 8 o’clock that evening. So I think the final joust is at 6 or 6:30. So we’ll have plenty of time to go hang out at the Renaissance Fair and fill up our camera with photos and selfies and everything from all of our amazing weekend with 120 of our best Tudor friends. So if you can come in person, please do that, we are hoping that this will be a huge success. And it’s going to be amazing to be around all of these other tutor enthusiasts. If you’re one of those people where when you start talking about Tudor history, people kind of roll their eyes, this is for you, because you’re going to be able to be with 120 other Tudor enthusiasts just like you and meet some of your favorite authors, and get your book signed, all that kind of stuff.
And if you truly can’t come to Pennsylvania, we actually have people coming from England and we have people coming over from different places. But if you really can’t come we have a digital ticket so you can get a digital ticket and then you can attend virtually all weekend long. So you can find out more about all of that at Englandcast.com/Tudorcon2019. We hope it will be a big success, and then we can do it every year, because how amazing would that be? And the only way that It’s going to be a big success is if you come, because it’s not going to be a success if nobody comes, right? So if you’re on the fence, if you’re thinking about it, if you have questions, if you want to know more information, please email me. Please get in touch with me, and I’m so happy to give you a call or to talk about more Tudorcon questions you might have.
So let me introduce Michael Radi to you. Michael Radi is a composer, lyricist, librettist, performer, vocal coach, and musical director currently residing in New York City. He graduated with a BA in Theater and English, and he recently completed the BMI Musical Theatre Writing Workshop as a lyricist, and maintains collaboration he formed within the program. So he’s written three full musical theater pieces including The King’s Legacy, and he continues to collaborate on other projects as well, including a musical adaptation of The Legend of Sleepy Hollow, and a family-oriented musical comedy set in a world of competitive baton twirling. Michael is in his eighth year as a vocal instructor, accompanist, and musical director at From Stage to Screen Studio in Huntington, New York on Long Island, where he teaches private voice students. So Michael Radi, I am so excited that he is going to be here. And I’m so excited to chat with him, and introduce you all to this amazing person, and his amazing musical.
(Clip from the musical)
Heather:
So, The King’s Legacy, just tell me to start with, a little bit about what the musical is about, because you kind of follow these women and well, I’ll let you talk. So tell me what it’s about.
Michael:
Sure. The King’s Legacy is mostly the story of Anne Boleyn and her journey for control of her own life in the midst of court, which is, as we all know, heavily patriarchal, and it’s a period of time where women really had no control of their own lives. And of course, at the same time, Henry is on his quest to obtain a male heir. And we all know how that turns out. So the focus of this story is mostly on Anne, however, since the true legacy of Henry was Queen Elizabeth I, there is a secondary storyline where we get to see Elizabeth growing up, as she learns from the later queens. Each of the queens has their own scene as we go through. We also see how Anne Boleyn affected Elizabeth. We used a device, an actual device in the show with a letter that Anne left for Elizabeth. And of course, that letter does not exist. But I think it’s pretty clear that Anne was a huge influence on Elizabeth. We all have heard the story of her carrying around the picture of Anne throughout her life. So I wanted to make sure that that influence from the other women was crystal clear. Because I think that is the beauty of the story, and why it’s so important, and why it should be told from their point of view, and not Henry’s.
Heather:
Yeah, and on your website, you talk about how the election kind of influenced wanting to share the story, and the parallels you saw between like Hillary Clinton and Anne Boleyn. And I always kind of hesitate a little bit about putting these modern labels like “feminism” and “modern constructs” on people who would have had no reference point for them. But can you tell me a little bit about kind of just what inspired this story, and how does a Broadway person get into Tudor stuff here? So share with me a little bit about kind of how you became interested in this, and then sort of what the inspiration I suppose for telling the story was?
Michael:
Okay, absolutely. Yeah. Ah, well, honestly, I was only introduced to the story in high school. My sister had studied abroad in England, and when she came back, she brought me that horrible history book – The Terrible Tudors, which I know a lot of you read. And that’s how they got introduced to the Tudors when they were young. And I just thought that the Henry story was very interesting. I was like, “Who’s this Anne Boleyn character?” She sounds absolutely fascinating. But I didn’t like dive into it yet at that point, I still, I was vaguely interested. And when I saw things, I had to relate to the Tudors, of course, I read them or I watched them. But then, throughout college, I was starting to get into writing musical theater. I’ve always been a performer, and I tried my hand out on a couple of things. And then my girlfriend at the time, she lent me The Other Boleyn Girl. And I read it and I was like, “Okay, Anne Boleyn is such a fascinating human. I want to write a musical about her.” And she was like, “Well, why don’t you try?” “Okay, great!” So that’s when I just like dove in headfirst into all the research, reading all these books, trying to see as much as I could, hear as much as I could. And I love the story so much. And I think, historically speaking, women get the short shrift in general because the history is mostly written by men and about the men. What about the importance of her journey and her story? And how that affected the entirety of history in Western Europe?
(Clip from the musical)
Heather:
I want to ask you about just how you set that to music? Because the music itself, (and people can listen to some of the songs, they’re on the internet, and you have like a couple of them on YouTube that I was listening to), and you have like some flavor of early music, but they’re still there. They’re theater, it’s Broadway music. So how did you kind of incorporate? Or how were you able to bring this story? What am I trying to get at, like bringing the essence of this to more modern kind of music and modern versions of storytelling?
Michael:
Oh, that’s a good question. I think that theater music has its own sound in general. So that is helpful in a lot of ways. Because as soon as you sit down into a theater, you know, you’re going to see a musical, unless it is something that is very specifically pop or rock or says, “Hey, we’re going to do this”, like Hamilton goes straight into pop and rap. Unless you’re going into something where you know that’s the case, I think there’s a general sound to theater music that is out of time and out of place. And that can be super helpful. It kind of transports you somewhere else. But at the same time, I definitely wanted to include flavors from the time period. So for instance, for the very first draft of this show, I decided, “You know what? I’m going to write a three-part madrigal.” Because that just seems correct, something that this show could include and should include. And that madrigal is still there, still in the show now. And I wanted to include some of Henry’s music as well. Throughout the show, most of it is very musical theater but with a flavor of the time period. There’s a dance sequence, we do the pageant, of course. I tried to keep a sound of something that might be heard at court, even not completely within the time period.
Heather:
I love this mixture. I love mixing stuff like this because people sometimes have this in their head like, history is for this kind of person, or that this kind of people learn history. So I guess, what do you think normal people who aren’t history nerds can take away from Henry’s story? From Anne’s story, because that’s what you’re focusing on? From Elizabeth? And from these people,  what is the ultimate legacy, I suppose?
Michael:
So there is a common thing that we talk about in musical theater. Well, two things here. The first is that, ultimately, it comes down to “Do you have a good story?” And I think where this one is concerned, there’s no doubt that this is a great story. It’s been told so many times because it’s such a great story. But then the other thing that we often look for when we’re deciding what to write about is a great irony. When you have someone who wants something so badly, and they very definitively don’t get it. So when it comes to both Henry and Anne, that is very clear. Henry wants that son to be his heir. And even though he doesn’t know, because he passed away, but it was Elizabeth who became the heir that really he had wanted the entire time. And this idea that she has no control over her life, as she works her way through court, and she makes her way up to being queen, and looks like everything’s gonna go swimmingly until well, then it doesn’t. I think those sorts of “No, you can’t do this”, or “The world is against you”, for some reason, these obstacles overcoming that, it’s very universal. So I don’t know that people who don’t know the history would walk in with much background knowledge. But I think the story itself is something that everyone can relate to.
Heather:
Yeah. And what was your kind of research? What was your research process like? And how long did it take you to write all of this? Tell me a little bit about just the process.
Michael:
Well, this one was difficult. I think the hardest thing was finding a narrative structure for this because it’s so much information over such a lengthy period of time. And so for a lot of musicals, you go through a couple of drafts, and then you find your big narrative structure. For this show, I’ve been working on it for over six years. And I don’t think I found the narrative structure that really worked for the piece until about 2016. And that’s what I’m using currently. And that’s where we’re really following Anne’s storyline in the majority of the show. And then we kind of take these sidebars off into Elizabeth’s storyline. For the longest time, that was the hardest thing. There are six queens and it takes place over 30 some years, especially if you’re including Elizabeth’s life in there. So that took a lot of time and a lot of effort. I’m thrilled with where it is. And I’ve also written so many songs over the years, and many of them are on the cutting room floor now. That’s the fun in musical theater.
Heather:
It’s interesting I suppose, to hear about a musical that is celebrating women, and celebrating feminism for lack of, I don’t know the Tudor version of the word “feminism”, I guess there would be “the woman question” that was going on the quote “querelle des femmes”, that was the French philosophy of being the role of women at that time. So we’ll go with that. But having that told from a man’s perspective, so I guess I wanted I want to ask you, what did you learn about women? What did you learn about feminism? Kind of how were you affected by this story?
Michael:
First, I will say it wasn’t too hard for me to dive into the female mindset. I grew up in a family where I have my mom and my two sisters, I also have my dad. But a little sidebar here, my sisters are World Champion baton twirlers, and my mother, she taught baton twirling for so many years privately in… and she’s the United States judge for the MBTA. So I grew up surrounded by women my entire life, constantly spending my weekends going to competitions. And most of the people I was around or friends with at the time were women. So I think that helped me in a lot of ways. Of course, that’s not the same as being a woman or having a woman’s experience. So there was a lot of me, talking with people who have felt being put down, or why being a woman is an extra obstacle, and what that means for their daily life or career. And I think over the past, what, three, four years? This explosion of this topic in the public forum has been really helpful as well. But then I was trying to focus a lot of my research, specifically on the women when looking back at the history, and this is what gets talked about all the time, is, this is a woman’s place, and here’s what she had to work with, and this is what she could do, what she couldn’t do. And that’s why this storyline is remarkable, because she did this, and that was crazy. No one was doing that at that time. And yeah, I think I just attempted to focus the most on the queens and on Elizabeth, because I think their stories are most interesting.
Heather:
It’s interesting because I think there’s a couple of different storylines around Anne and it’s that debate of whether or not she really was what we would call a “feminist”. Because on one hand, it does seem like she doesn’t have an agency for lack of a better word. But at the same time, she gets a lot of what she wants. And I sometimes think that putting her in this box of the fragile woman who couldn’t ultimately, you know, who was the pawn of her family, and who didn’t have any kind of ability to run her life; puts her in this box is really kind of taking away from what she did have, which was quite a lot. And I guess, I wonder, there’s sort of this dichotomy, this push and pull with Anne. Because on one hand, she ultimately couldn’t bear a son. And that was probably Henry’s fault. People could argue that. But that’s just a quirk of biology. But at the same time, she was able to do so much. And she was able to become queen, and she was able to get in there when it was very, very rare for women to have done, for common women to become queen. So how do you balance that I guess?
Michael:
Oh, well, that was one of the hardest parts of this show. I think part of my journey in writing Anne as a character has been walking that fine line. But I was doing the BMI Musical Theatre Writing Workshop a few years ago, and something one of the moderators said really struck me, which is that “No matter who these people are – the protagonist, the antagonist, a side character, they have to be a complete human. And there’s good with that. And there’s bad with that.” So that I think has been my focus with Anne, is making sure that she is a fully fleshed out rounded-out human with her flaws, but also with her wonderful qualities. And so I think that pushes aside the need to really think about “Okay, is she being a pawn? Is she being used here? Is she doing something miraculous?” She was just telling her story. There’s no doubt that she was heavily put upon by her family, or by outside influences, and of course, by Henry. But she still did these things. And that shows a lot of not only guts, but also, you can’t be someone who’s hated and accomplished what she accomplished.
Heather:
Right. Yeah. And you can’t be someone who’s just a pawn, and who doesn’t have any kind of agency, and still do what she was able to do, and would have done if she had been able to have a son.
Michael:
Yes, of course. Yeah. Although I do wonder if their relationship would have stayed positive even with a son.
Heather:
We haven’t even talked about you, and who you are. Here’s this guy, he wrote a musical. So I want to make sure we get to plug all of your work in here, because you haven’t just written this musical, and I want to make sure people know how to find out more about it. And you’re going to be at Tudorcon, so hooray for that! So tell me more about you. And where people can find your work and everything like that.
Michael:
Absolutely. So I’m a New York State guy, I grew up in upstate New York. And so I started writing music when I was a kid, and then I tried my hand at playwriting in college. And I was not very good at that. So I decided to put the two together and see if I could write some musical theater. I’d always been performing since elementary school, and I loved that, and I knew I want to keep going with that. So since college, I’ve been writing musicals, and performing in musicals. My very first original musical was actually my honors project at Geneseo. And not only did I write the book, music, and lyrics at a time when I didn’t really know what I was doing, but then I had to stage it as well. So I was the director, and the musical director, and producer, it was crazy. It was a crazy time. But then that show, which is called PICk Love, moved on to the Rochester Fringe Festival in 2012. And from then on, I was kind of hooked with writing musical theater, and I wanted to learn more. So I went to the BMI Musical Theater Writing Workshop in New York City. I did that for two years as a lyricist. And I’ve met a whole bunch of people who I now collaborate with on other projects, including my writing partner, I have a composer for The Legend of Sleepy Hollow. It’s an adaptation. And that had an open workshop for the first time this past year. And so we’re still working on that. Because of my family’s baton twirling connection, I’m writing a musical comedy based off that as well with a different collaborator. So I try to wear as many hats as possible. So The King’s Legacy is me. Book, music, and lyrics. This one is definitely my baby, the one I’ve been working on for the longest, I think. Yeah, but you can find out all the information on my website, which is michaelradi.com And that’ll show you all what I’m doing performance-wise, and all the work I do on Long Island. I teach musical theater, and I teach voice on Long Island throughout the year, and then I’ve been performing in the summers. And of course, all the information for the musical is on the website, which is thekingslegacymusical.com.
Heather:
And so this is opening in August, right?
Michael:
Yes, August 22.
Heather:
That’s the anniversary of my first date with my husband.
Michael:
Well, what a way to celebrate, wanna come to see the show?
Heather:
So August 22. And it’s in upstate New York, right?
Michael:
Yes, at the Western New York Finger Lakes area. It’s Naples, New York, which is a beautiful little vacation town. It’s absolutely gorgeous. I have worked at this theater, Bristol Valley Theatre, Wine Country. It’s a delightful place to be. And the work here is stunning. So I was super thrilled when I had brought them the idea of doing the first production. They’re like, “Yeah, that sounds great. Let’s do it. I trust you. You are wonderful people. I know it’s gonna be fantastic.”
Heather:
Oh, that’s awesome. That’s so great. So anybody who’s in that area should definitely go check it out in August. And then you’re going to be at Tudorcon doing some of the songs. So that’s very exciting. So what do you think makes this so popular? How? Why is the musical theater world just catching on to Henry VIII and to Anne Boleyn?
Michael:
That is an excellent question. I don’t really know. I will say, and so it’s not just Six. Six is the one that has the most I think, visibility right now. But there are a couple other shows being written about this topic now too, that have started in the past maybe two years. And I really couldn’t tell you why now is the time. But I have not heard anything from any of the other shows except for Six. I can say that, I think my show holds a unique place theatrically. Because it was so rooted in classical musical theater sound. Well, I mean, it still has contemporary sound to it as well. But I’m between that and the fact that it is focused on specifically Anne’s journey, and celebrating women’s accomplishments during that time, whereas Six is definitely more of like a concert. And they’re very girl power, but they don’t give a lot of the story.
Heather:
It reminds me of Newton and Leibnitz both discovered calculus at the same exact time without even talking to each other, and then there was this big argument over who actually was the first person to discover calculus – was it Newton or Leibnitz? It’s like independent at the same time. And it’s like when good ideas come, they hit multiple people at one time, so they come to life more, I suppose?
Michael:
Yeah. Plus, I mean, how many books are there? How many movie adaptations? How many TV shows? Like there’s a place for all that I think.
(Clip from the musical)
Heather:
And I love what you said on the website about how we’ve all been told that we can’t do things, and having to fight back, and having to fight for our place in the world. And that’s really kind of what this is about, from what I can tell. And that’s just such a beautiful message for people. So do you kind of want to give me some final takeaways based off of that? For why people should follow this musical? And go see it, and get involved with you?
Michael:
Yeah, well, I think we’ve all had that moment in our lives, maybe a big one, maybe a lot of small ones, where there’s just something you want so badly. And whether it’s the authority figure telling you “No”, or the world telling you “No”. And you just decide, “You know what, I’m gonna do it anyway.” And I feel that like that’s something that resonates particularly with a lot of young people at the moment. Particularly with people who worked in any sort of low-paying or artistic industry. At some point, you just got to be yourself. And that’s really what this show is about is – yourself. And then hopefully, you can navigate it in the way that you want to. And unfortunately, that doesn’t work out for Anne and Henry necessarily, but I think there’s a lot of hope in the show. Because Queen Elizabeth I, who knew that she would become what she was, right?
Heather:
And that’s the thing too. You never know, right? Success comes in lots of different ways that you might never know. So being open to however it looks.
Michael:
Yeah, precisely.
Heather:
So beautiful. So many beautiful messages. I am so excited that we spoke because in five years when you’re on Broadway, I’m going to say he was on my podcast.
Michael:
And you’ll be at Opening Night, of course.
Heather:
I will totally be there, I will totally be there! Thank you so much for taking the time to share all of this.
Michael:
Thank you.
(Clip from the musical)
Heather:
Thank you so much to Michael for sharing his experience with writing The King’s Legacy. I just love a collaboration like this, like Tudors and musicals. It just goes together, right? Like peanut butter and jelly, or peanut butter and ice cream, or peanut butter and pretty much anything. So listen, if you listen to this and you’re excited, and you want to come to Tudorcon and see it live and all of that, please go to Englandcast.com/Tudorcon2019 and we will see you in Pennsylvania in October, or we’ll see you digitally online. And I will be back again in about two weeks. I’m going to do an episode on fools, Tudor fools. Because that’s going to be fun, right? All right. I will speak with you soon.
[advertisement insert here: if you like this show, and you want to support me and my work, the best thing you can do (and it’s free!) is to leave us a rating on iTunes. It really helps others discover the podcast. Second best is to buy Tudor-themed gifts for all your loved ones at my shop, at TudorFair.com, like leggings with the Anne Boleyn portrait pattern on them, or boots with Elizabeth I portraits. Finally, you can also become a patron of this show for as little as $1/episode at Patreon.com/englandcast … And thank you!]
Want more Tudor in your life? Join the Tudor Learning Circle - the only social network devoted solely to Tudor History. Sign up free at TudorLearningCircle.com! And why not Tudorfy your YouTube algorithm by getting exclusive videos and content on Heather's YouTube channel!
Heather Teysko is the creator, writer, and producer of The Renaissance English History Podcast,  one of the longest running indie history podcasts, going since 2009. She's been writing about history online for over 25 years, since her first site on Colonial American history became number one in history on Yahoo in 1998. She writes books, created the original Tudor Planner (a yearly diary filled with Tudor history) and in 2019 created the world's first Tudorcon (you can "attend" online this year!). She has been passionate about Tudor England since she first read Alison Weir's The Six Wives of Henry VIII 20 years ago, and subsequently moved to London after college to spend her time immersed in Tudor history.